Worst Concept of All Time...

[ender098]

I was just over at JBL and they had a thread titled "Worst Concept of All time". A lot of guy were stating Cobra-la, others were saying Ninja force....what do you think? What concept in the GI Joe Universe is the absolute worst of the worst?


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[Urban Saboteur]

Having thought about it, alot of them do have possibilities.. i mean when you look at all the concepts anyway.. and look at GIJOE how it started and grown into what it is today.. a regurgatated mish mash of its former self..
there all pretty bad.. and none of them come close to the original GIJOE highly trained special forces team..
I think the main issue is that they started out a codename group to battle terrorism.. and throughout their evolvement went through so many different concept changes they lost their identity..
Star Brigade, Eco Warriors, Ninja Force.. Cobra La.. they are all concepts of the GIJOE Universe.. each of them has a following and fanbase.. and each of them has it's critics.. and haters..
The only one I really dont seem to criticise is Night Force.. those guys seemed to do ok. They still appear to be popular in collections today.

Lets see..
Special Missions (86)
Sgt.Slaughters Renegades (87)
Cobra La Team (87)
Tiger Force (88)
Night Force (88)
Python Patrol (89)
Slaughters Marauders (89)
Sky Patrol (90)
Sonic Fighters (90) & Super Sonic Fighters (91)
Eco-Warriors (91)
Air Commandos (91)
Talking Battle Commanders (91)
DEF (92)
Ninja Force (92)
Battle Corps (93)
Dino Hunters (93)
Mega Marines (93)
Street Fighter (93)
Star Brigade (93)
Shadow Ninjas (94)
30th Anniversary (94)
Oktober Guard (98)
The Real American Hero Releases (00)
Manimals (01)
GIJOE Vs Cobra (02)
Spy Troops (03)
Valor Vs Venom (04)
Comic Packs (04)
Desert Patrol/Team Packs such as Cobra Night Watch and Anti Venom Task Force (04)
Direct to Consumer (05)
25th Anniversary (07)

Ok.. so we have more than enough concepts and versions to shake a stick at, and as I said before, it's difficult to pick one.. the sonic fighters I always thought were pretty out there.. but then again.. cobra la isnt exactly on your doorstep military either is it?
Mega Marines werent bad in all fairness, i just didnt like the colours.. i bought them though right, right? it's what hasbro wanted and what i liked at that age.

How does everyone else feel about this?

[Self-Modifier]

I've gotta give it to Star Brigade. As you all know, I have no problem when G.I. Joe gets a little crazy sometimes, but turning them all into astronauts is a bit much even for me!

[lehsreh]

[COLOR=Red]in order

ninja force
dino hunters(but then again i never really saw these so i cant say)
eco-warriors
DEF[/COLOR]

[Outrider]

Cobra La, Manimals, and all the ninja cr@p. :rolleyes:

[Lava Boss]

There's more concepts than that.

Ones I didn't like at the time:

Action/Vehicle Packs sucked., big backpacks that had wind up features and cost as much as a figure.

And any deluxe figures sucked in some way, because really, I wanted the figure not the gimmick.

Air Commandos, buying gaudy gliders to get new figures. $8 each

Battle Copters, had to buy a useless to get a figure, $8 IIRC

Super/Sonic Fighters. Most were repaints. $6 to $7 for a repaint and there were 8 different sounds but 12 figures.

Shadow Ninjas are awful. $5, I think.

Star Brigade Armor Tech was less articulated figures with gorilla proportions. $5.

Eco-Warriors, you know...$5 each

$5 isn't that much today. But remember figures like Big Ben were $3 U.S. at retail.

So would you rather buy 5 figures or 3 eco warriors? Or two Super Sonic Fighters?

[troopsofdoom]

[QUOTE=Urban Saboteur]Special Missions (86)[/QUOTE]
I really liked Special Missions. I found them to be more grounded in reality, which is when I think GI Joe is at it's best. But of course there were a few duds. At the time I liked the regular series more but now when I read the back issues I'm starting to like SM more.

[troopsofdoom]

Cobra La is the most obvious choice for worst concept but I'm gonna make a prediction and say the up-coming live action movie.

[Sonneilon]

What was wrong with the special missions concept? Because it started to cross over with the main title?

[Swindle]

Hasbro's crappy and thankfully shortlived policy of not making characters who died in the comics.

[Bayer]

[QUOTE=troopsofdoom]I really liked Special Missions. I found them to be more grounded in reality, which is when I think GI Joe is at it's best. But of course there were a few duds. At the time I liked the regular series more but now when I read the back issues I'm starting to like SM more.[/QUOTE]

I agree completely. There were duds but all in all the series was much better that the regular comic of the time - I know because I was collecting both back in the day. I was also disinclined to collect the regular series when it became Snake Eyes featuring GI Joe (Ninja Force), and the Eco Force was crappy because it was nothing but neon rereleases of the other equipment. Cobra-La (Ha,Ha) was a joke, Star Brigade was an insult and the Tiger Force/Sky Patrol weren't even close to the military equivalent.

I loved the GI Joe - A REAL American Hero. When things went out into X-Men weirdsville, I disconnected.

[Scarrviper]

Let's see

tiger force

Cobra la

star brigade ( a few gem molds though)

Manimals

shadow ninjas (this was even worse than ninja force)

the 25th bodystyle

slaughters maurauders

battle force 2000

the new movie

neon color schemes and weapons

sound attack

t crotch figures

gimmics like sound backbacks, etc (we did get great figures with them though)

[Trench-Viper]

The worst concept to me was the Lunartrix empire.
Aliens? GI Joe is going to fight aliens with english names? Gah.

[EasySimpleStuff]

Hmm...lets see...

NEON COLORS!!!

Regardles of what sub-team or whatever a figure belongs to, neon colors will ruin him/her 100% sure.

I.e, as bad as concepts like Star Brigade or Ninja Force were, neon colors was the biggest issue for me, as it ruined sometimes a perfectly good mold (imagine how different, and perhaps cool, Dojo, T'jabang + others would have looked if not in neon-frigging-colors)

So NO more Neon...ever!

[ender098]

Know what I hated? The 3 vehicles in one (or two in one, etc), like the Mamba, the Mean Dog, the Maggot, the Condor. All cool Vehicles, but their parts were crappy. They should have just left them as one!

Th Raider was cool, but split it into 2 parts and your guns are stranded!?!? WTF? The only vehicle I think that did the 3-in-1 concept well was the ThunderClap. Yeah, the little cars on the end were crap, but it made sense. It was like they took an old WWI rail gun and, using small tractors made it more mobile!

I don't consider The Rolling thunder a 2 or 3 in one. The little Car on it was an extra. And the revolving missile carousel, stupid, but tolerable! The Whale had two cool detachable things, the minibike and the sled. The Night Raven's pod was ok and the Havoc's hovercraft was alright.

What about Destro's Dominator? If it's a tank it's heavily armored...then how can it fly? If it's a Helicopter, how can it have enough Armor to be a tank on the ground?

Battleforce 2000? Great Idea, crappy concept. I was soooo excited to get a new fortress, until I realized it was just parts you layed down. None of the Parts snapped together! I could have just taken the vehicles and circled them and had the same thing.

Know what I WOULD like to see......

Wait...I'll make a new thread for that!

[yorktownjoe]

Cobra-La is obviously out there. But that was a point where they "jumped the shark." Things steadily declined from there, though some good figures still appeared after that.

Eco-warriors was not even a slightly veiled concept lumping "not-so-eco-friendly" corporations from the early 90's with terrorists. That was a concept. A seed to plant in young minds that would hopefully grow into environmental consciousness/responsibility. I'm not passing judgment on the rightness or wrongness of that idea. But planting seeds in children's minds is far past any line I would draw. Lobbyists should not raise kids, parents should.

Back to the topic... Did anyone mention G.I.Joe: Extreme? Cryogenics and WWII must have been interesting in the 90's.

[rds13601]

During Image's comics run of Transformers vs Gi Joe. there were no
vehicles like the hiss, ,stun, snake that could have transformed into a robot and supported a 3.75 fig. That would have been cool. What killed it was taking great original sculpts and making the second sculpt of that character look dumb. IE green 1992 Firefly. I think 1992 did it for me

[Self-Modifier]

[QUOTE=yorktownjoe]Cryogenics and WWII must have been interesting in the 90's.[/QUOTE]

When you really think about it, are either of those things ever not interesting? ;)

[Sonneilon]

Blame cryogenics on us sci-fi guys! AND Michael Jackson!!!

[ThinkTank]

battle force 2000 was the beginning of the end. In my memory, it was the first weird thing they did with Joe and then after that it was all neon and ninja force and on and on.

[Flatline]

[QUOTE=ThinkTank]battle force 2000 was the beginning of the end. In my memory, it was the first weird thing they did with Joe and then after that it was all neon and ninja force and on and on.[/QUOTE]
I THINK THATS WHEN I CALLED IT QUITS TOO :(

[guiltridden]

Cobra la la la la la la la la la!
The movie is where i lost it as a kid new characters were cool but not the cobra la concept. No big Lob figure either just made me mad

[Flatline]

[QUOTE=guiltridden]Cobra la la la la la la la la la!
The movie is where i lost it as a kid new characters were cool but not the cobra la concept. No big Lob figure either just made me mad[/QUOTE]
YOU WANTED BIG LOB TOO? LOL :D I THOGHT I WAS ALONE THERE.

[cyko]

[QUOTE=ThinkTank]battle force 2000 was the beginning of the end. In my memory, it was the first weird thing they did with Joe and then after that it was all neon and ninja force and on and on.[/QUOTE]
I liked the concept of BF2000 a lot; it felt like Joe was trying to over R&D weapons to beat MARS and Cobra. Laser guns and the like. But the production was poor. All the figures are barrel-chested guys, and the vehicles are poorly inspired (Eliminator front gun design recycled for the Maurader rear gun, Eliminator & Sky Sweeper serve the same function, Vector gun turret too "bubbley"...). The Pulverizer the next year was the nail in the coffin. Development coincided with a lot of bright figures and goofy concepts, and I lost interest.

I agree with the idea that as GI Joe veered further away from reality, their ideas were worse for it. Eco-terrorism and space flight are grabbing at straws, if you ask me. And surely not everybody in the military is a ninja!

[Lava Boss]

Yeah, not enough thought put into BF 2000. GI JOE had high tech gear from the get go, jet packs and lasers, so the premise wasn't bad. However, so much regular JOE stuff was odd that what could've been done was to split the line into psuedo-realism and BF 2000 lines. Things like the RAIDER are BF 2000, and maybe the X-wing copter, too. Maybe that was a plan, as the last additions, Pulverizer and Dee-Jay had no connections to the original fortress concept. The future fortress concept was weak in terms of execution. There was also the idea they were supposed to fight the Iron Grenadiers, since the 1988 IG stuff has the BF 2000 logo and they share background "digital explosion" colors. Yet they never really fought them in the comic.

[Rambo]

The NEON brigade.

[Ion]

I must agree with the "Neon Brigade"... That was just killing some great ideas...

Apart from that - I really don't have any any sub team in mind as a worst idea. But again - situation was different here.
As you probably know, in Poland, we know Joes from, let's say around the 1990 series and later. So we have no really good Joes to compare to. And - for example cpt. Grid Iron was an awesome figure for us back then - looking tough, with whole lot of gear!
Ninja force? No problem with this series for me, as well as Eco Warriors or Mega Marines :)
Star Brigade is not my favourite and marks the end of this toys - but I got used to it somehow.

I believe it's all a matter of a Joe market at a time. You guys were all lucky because you got them from the beginning :D

But there's one thing that I can't stand. The 25th body style... Great idea, but poor execution... I don't like them being oversized, but most of all - HEADS!! Considering a hollow chin, it all looks like a mask on some kind of alien.. And reminds me more of a doll than an Action Figure.
I suppose that the only figure that will appear in my collection from the 25th is Nemesis immortal, but apart from him - you'll never see me having this "things" in my collection.

[ender098]

[QUOTE=cyko] And surely not everybody in the military is a ninja![/QUOTE]



We are, it's just that no one knows....Oops! now you know .....*WHUFF**WHUFF**WHUFF* (kills Cyko with poison tipped blowgun darts!!)

LOL! :eek: :D

[Outrider]

[QUOTE=Ion]But there's one thing that I can't stand. The 25th body style... Great idea, but poor execution... I don't like them being oversized, but most of all - HEADS!! Considering a hollow chin, it all looks like a mask on some kind of alien.. And reminds me more of a doll than an Action Figure.[/QUOTE]

I'm glad I'm not alone in my thoughts on the 25th figures. :)

[rds13601]

General scarlett being a moderator.oh and I want my figures back

[Trench-Viper]

[QUOTE=rds13601]General scarlett being a moderator.oh and I want my figures back[/QUOTE]
Huh?

[Rambo]

[QUOTE=rds13601]General scarlett being a moderator.oh and I want my figures back[/QUOTE]

What happened?